I got a fever and the only prescription is more cowbell...

Hey kirinke,

Even when such behaviors are pervasive on this forum, I would avoid playing the whataboutism game, reducing the frequency of expletives, and abstaining from direct personal attacks. It doesn't really prove anything or lend strength to an argument; consequently, it undermines both the poster and post. Ultimately, a poster can only control the quality of their posts (and not of others).

Instead, try refuting evileeyore's assertion that all Biden's campaign promises were lies. Biden has kept more than one promise (perhaps even five or more) which would prove the claim inaccurate. Use least-biased (as opposed to politically-leaning) fact-checking sites that provide source references such as PolitiFact^[1] and FactCheck.org^[2]. I personally avoid referencing Snopes^[3] (over others when fact-checking) as they seem to be more politically-leaning when compared to others and consequently more likely to be discounted. Provide links to help support your refutation. Although you don't need to, try my approach to links (using citation numbering) to improve readability. I find it sad that most posts on this forum seem to lack research (owing to the lack of references).

There is an added bonus to all of this, research and reflection can help broaden one's perspectives. When one's initial assumptions are at least partially incorrect, one should openly accept it. Personally, I find improving my understanding about a subject more rewarding than the optics of having "bested" another participant. A successful discourse is when everyone comes away learning something new. I also only post a small fraction of my responses, taking hours (or even days) considering whether or not such a response is befitting enough to be posted. Occasionally, no response might be the most sensible course of action.

¹ PolitiFact
² FactCheck.org
³ Snopes

So you're happy he's ramping up the war in Afghanistan again, bombing Yemen, re-engaging in hostilities in Syria, opening new cages that Trump closed because he's run out room in the old cages, not removing the tax breaks for the rich, that he lied about having a "better plan than Trump" for COVID, rolling over on minimum wage, and completely reneging on the stimulus checks?

I mean there's more, but I'd rather he actually not deliver on those promises (new gun control, repealing the Hyde Act, firing the Post Master, student loan forgiveness, rejoining the Iran deal, etc).

Like, kirinke, the only two things he's done are rejoin the WHO and reverse the transgender "ban" in the military*. Which are both terrible positions.


* It's not a ban, it's just holding transgenders to the same mental fitness and health standards as everyone else. But the military is famous for not holding everyone to the same standards†, so why not depreciate our fighting force even more with people who cannot perform to fighting requirements. Doesn't matter, just sending them off to commit suicide anyway.

† Women are still not held to the same standards as men because they cannot make the minimum requirements so that was suspended. So now we're sending soldiers into combat who cannot perform to the minimum standards and the squad has to carry their share... which leads to whole new problems for women serving in the military.

Ahem:
Nothing is fundamentally changing (except possibly the sharing of intelligence which was aimed at reducing the atrocities).  And you support this.


Don't care. We need to stop killing people in foreign countries for no greater reason than "well we've been doing it for 20 years now*, and it keeps getting worse, but next year we'll get it right".

Stop supporting the murder of foreigners.


* By which I mean Afghanistan.  We've been murdering brown kids in turbans for over a hundred years in the name of oil, so it really is an "American Tradition" at this point.


Why do you support the killing of foreigners by our military? Do you even understand why we're over there killing people in Syria?


Same "cages" Trump was crucified for, so I'm fine crucifying Biden on that cross.

You didn't read the article did you? It's pay-walled, but you liked the headline right?  Because the article has nothing concrete and nothing of substance from Biden or Harris.

Inversely, straight from Biden's mouth on the campaign trail:

Joe Biden to rich donors: "Nothing would fundamentally change" if he's elected

“I love Bernie, but I’m not Bernie Sanders. I don’t think 500 billionaires are the reason why we’re in trouble,” Biden said at an event in March.

But by all means, the WaPo says he's "All about taxing the rich, it'll just take time, like say 4+ years, so go back to sleep Brunch Wine Dems and let Daddy Biden do what he's done for fifty years"... namely make mistake after mistake after mistake.

But maybe 3cat is right and Biden's handlers can leash him in and he'll make their mistakes instead of his own? Because the DNC is so great...

Which was a fat lot of nothing. Hell, he mandated masks be worn on federal property but his own administration continues to ignore this. So... oh yeah, effective.

You like to put links in to articles which a whole lot of nothing on the topic don't you?

Biden privately tells governors: Minimum wage hike likely isn’t happening

Biden faces questions about commitment to minimum wage hike

In other words, Biden is willing to say the words, but he's not about to fight this fight. He doesn't care. He made the noise he needed to to get into office with this issue, but he won't fight for it, and when it dies on the vine, he wont give a shit. Oh, he'll say "Well if only it hadn't been for the obstructionist Republicans when the Democrats control the House, the Senate, and the Presidency... err... we could have done it but for those pesky obstructionist Republicans..."

Mark my words.

Why are you okay with Biden spending more political capital on getting Neera Tanden’s nomination passed* than on this? It was right there before the congress and VP Harris could have overruled the Parliamentarian, but nope. "Let's let this can get kicked down the road so hopefully when it fails later the public won't care as much". That's the actual strategy being deployed and you're falling for it.


* I'm mean it failed, but he was willing to fight for her nomination but not the stimulus, which he not only had the votes, but the means? It was a shoe-in and he said "nah man"?

Yeah, but you didn't do the hard part, the reading and evaluating.

And he's squandered* all but two of them he's signed so far. Admittedly overruling the Military Trans "Ban" was effective. The wrong move, but effective.


* I mean okay, removing Trump teams and replacing them with his, sure, sure, that's an effective rearrangement of the Titanic's deck chairs, and sure his team of handpicked politicians, bureaucrats, and corporatocrats will be more effective at doing what he wants than Trump's team (maybe, I suspect most of Trump's appointees would be fine with working for another centrist).

Yes exactly. All the pictures of those "overflow facilities" festively decorated for the kids?  That was under trump, after those facilities were opened, and he was crucified for them because they are "for profit centers". The pictures of kids with thin foil blankies? Taken under Obama.

CNN/MSNBC/etc have been lying to you. The facilities Biden is reopening? Closed because Trump was crucified for using a for profit company to run the shelters... and now Biden is refilling them, using the same company, and you're not even questioning it because, haha, the lefty media is putting a shiny spin on it for you.

Can't be chastising Biden after all.

Which were built by whom again? At least lay blame for the start of that shit where it properly belongs.

The ones Trump had built but was crucified for.

Which Trump also did.

CNN's spin is the only difference.

In his own words "Nothing will change". You can believe what you want, but he does have a 50 year political career you can go check. His own actions will prove his words here.

If he were, he'd have had VP Harris overrule the parliamentarian and had it pushed through. He had the requisite 40 votes necessary. He didn't care to get it done.

Political cartoons might count as a 'fuck you' in a debate, but they're hardly proof 3cat. It's no real defense.