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Post by evileeyore on Feb 6, 2022 22:14:39 GMT
Now, honestly, I KNOW Bernie calls himself a socialist, but he's into social Democracy, not socialism. I don't think I have ever seen him advocate true socialism. People keep saying this, but I think you're paying more attention to Big Media than to the man. I also think what he wants (to go further left than Europe) and what he thinks might be achievable in his lifetime (to go slightly further left than the US currently is) are two different things.
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Post by libtard on Feb 6, 2022 23:33:11 GMT
I suspect that my views comport more closely with the other 7.4 billion people living on the planet who aren't Americans.
God, you are such a parochial gynophobic neofascist.
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Post by cyphersmith on Feb 7, 2022 1:12:49 GMT
Now, honestly, I KNOW Bernie calls himself a socialist, but he's into social Democracy, not socialism. I don't think I have ever seen him advocate true socialism. People keep saying this, but I think you're paying more attention to Big Media than to the man. I also think what he wants (to go further left than Europe) and what he thinks might be achievable in his lifetime (to go slightly further left than the US currently is) are two different things. I don't think I have seen him saying he wants to get rid of business owned by individuals or small groups. Though I know he supports employee-owned business. You could be right about his personal preferences, but since he's not advocating those things, I don't think it matters.
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Post by libtard on Feb 7, 2022 7:19:14 GMT
People keep saying this, but I think you're paying more attention to Big Media than to the man. I also think what he wants (to go further left than Europe) and what he thinks might be achievable in his lifetime (to go slightly further left than the US currently is) are two different things. I don't think I have seen him saying he wants to get rid of business owned by individuals or small groups. Though I know he supports employee-owned business. You could be right about his personal preferences, but since he's not advocating those things, I don't think it matters. Bernie doesn't - AFAICT - advocate for the state owning the means of production, although this isn't a defining feature of "soft" socialism in the mold of Scandinavia or Germany's SDP. I'd place him further left than - say - Keir Starmer, who's really a corporate patsy hell bent on purging the Labour party in the UK of any genuine socialist elements, but not as far left as Mélenchon - although much of France's left has been absorbed by Macron's center. When you strip away policies which are just accepted as "normal" within much of Europe - higher direct tax burden (especially for the wealthy), free or affordable healthcare systems, more robust trade unions, free higher education, a general willingness to accept interventionst policies from government etc. - then Bernie looks a lot less leftist. He's striving to achieve a baseline which Europe achieved decades ago - much of which was possible, ironically, with the help of American $$$ in the wake of WWII. I have to say that my experience of trade unions in the USA - working in a managerial capacity - was not positive, and reminded me of regressive European elements from the 80s. I was sort of dumbfounded that the closed shop was still a thing, it being deemed an affront to workers' rights by the EU some time back in the early 90s. And the accountability of trade union reps in the US - don't even get me started. I would normally consider myself staunchly pro-union, but I think the relationship between unions and management in Europe is generally more collaborative, and less adversarial (I was disciplined for calling the union rep at my work a petty-minded Stalinist, which is admittedly rather adversarial). And it bothered me no end that "you can't work here unless you donate 5% of your paycheck to the Democrats": their super PAC blew $14M on psycho Hillary in the 2016 election. That was the SEIU, who are also corrupt as hell; obviously my experience may have differed if I'd been in a different environment.
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Post by libtard on Feb 7, 2022 16:35:33 GMT
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Post by evileeyore on Feb 8, 2022 17:50:46 GMT
I have to say that my experience of trade unions in the USA - working in a managerial capacity - was not positive, and reminded me of regressive European elements from the 80s. A lot of unions in the US are regressive and corrupt as fuck, though there are the occasional really good ones, and I wouldn't advocate for doing away with Unions, just reform. And reform that isn't de facto written by Wal*Mart, Amazon, etc... TL/DR: Ned Price is a shithead who can't properly hold a press conference and we need more journalists like Lee.
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Post by libtard on Feb 8, 2022 20:03:40 GMT
Preach it.
Matt Taibbi has speculated at length about how the social class of journalists has changed over the last generation, and the extent to which they are now divorced from their audience. His father worked for NBC back in the 60s, when journalism was a "trade" and not something which metropolitan hipsters with Gucci glasses pursued in order to schmooze with the private secretaries of members of Congress (to paraphrase him).
Taibbi has his own issues (and I by no means agree with everything he says or stands for), but the fact that he's one of those on the outside, looking in, still gives me hope that objective journalism isn't dead. It's just so damn time consuming to trawl through news media to try and extract nuggets of nonpartisan reporting.
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Post by evileeyore on Feb 9, 2022 15:13:56 GMT
It's just so damn time consuming to trawl through news media to try and extract nuggets of nonpartisan reporting. It is. When I don't have time I just read something shilling for the left and from the right and where they overlap consistently I figure a small amount of facts lay.
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Post by libtard on Feb 11, 2022 4:10:25 GMT
New anti-protest laws enacted in the USA since 2017. Dark blue = enacted; light blue = pending Apparently quashing freedom to assemble is a thoroughly bipartisan effort. Dems seem a bit sluggish, overall.
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Post by libtard on Feb 11, 2022 18:24:38 GMT
Worth reading. David Sirota on corporate media misinformation: link
Takeaway: people all know Fox is full of shit; their mistake is in thinking that any other legacy media outlet is somehow different. Yes, I understand that the Jacobin is hard leftist. So sue me.
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Post by evileeyore on Feb 13, 2022 18:03:35 GMT
Takeaway: people all know Fox is full of shit; their mistake is in thinking that any other legacy media outlet is somehow different. Including the Jacobin itself, right? Right?Of course not, their immune to the smell of their own shit. And I love this is piece of fuckery from them: "Obviously, multiple wrongs don’t make a right. Rogan platforming public health nonsense and environmental misinformation — and using racial slurs — is not somehow absolved by corporate media concurrently immersing the world in an ocean of self-serving bullshit. His behavior is bad on its own merits. Full stop. No, that's more of that there misinformation. There is nothing wrong with Rogan using slurs, especially in the context they were said (which was in discussing the shift in socpol in the US and the world, and the growing authoritarianism of the left). He isn't a news show, it's opinion pieces where he asks "average Joe questions" of people who are celebs, doctors, politicians, entrepreneurs, scientists, etc, watchers/listeners know going in they're getting opinions, not "consensual facts". Granted I can understand where a lefty org would mistake talking about opinions as "presenting facts", since that's what they do all day long. I will admit they are spot on with raking their fellow mass media chums, too bad they can't look as critically at themselves: Wayback link for anyone wanting to read it without giving the Jacobin a click.
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Post by libtard on Feb 14, 2022 11:36:32 GMT
Takeaway: people all know Fox is full of shit; their mistake is in thinking that any other legacy media outlet is somehow different. Including the Jacobin itself, right? Right?To a point. I think there's a difference between banging an ideological drum (as the Jacobin does), and actively promoting a corporate agenda which is bound up with the machinery of power. Joe Rogan is just a bloke with a podcast. The fact that so many people are listening to him - and taking his random stoner musings seriously - is just another reflection on how much distrust MSM has garnered at this point. He never expected this level of exposure or influence. The fact that CNN and MSNBC are wailing on Rogan so much is a useful distraction to prevent their own bullshit being scrutinized, while they can still have "defense experts" on (who do side work for the Pentagon and/or Lockheed Martin) and get people in the mood for whatever bullshit war they're pushing.
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Post by kirinke on Feb 14, 2022 12:45:06 GMT
To be honest, I've never heard of Rogan before CNN and MSNBC started running stories on him and amping him up. Nor do I really care about him one way or another.
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Post by evileeyore on Feb 14, 2022 16:20:01 GMT
I think there's a difference between banging an ideological drum (as the Jacobin does), and actively promoting a corporate agenda which is bound up with the machinery of power. Maybe. I'll grant you, the Jacobin isn't part of a larger conglomerate, but it is the propaganda arm of the Democratic Socialists. No one can ever predict that they'll be the next Howard Stern, It's also a way for the Left to silence an outlet that allows disagreement with them. Two birds, one stone. To be honest, I've never heard of Rogan before CNN and MSNBC started running stories on him and amping him up. Well of course not. Break out of your echo chamber? Who would expect that! You should, the Left is trying to censor a show that allows dissent with the Left (as well as the Right and everyone else). Social-political censorship is dangerous.
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Post by libtard on Feb 15, 2022 8:43:30 GMT
To be honest, I've never heard of Rogan before CNN and MSNBC started running stories on him and amping him up. Nor do I really care about him one way or another. I've been following him - mostly his progress, rather than his actual content - since around 2013. My wife used to listen to him from around 2010 onwards - from what she has said, he has drifted further right over that period, and I definitely remember getting more of a hippy vibe from him back then. Lots of crackpots on his show, but drawn from across the political spectrum. Moving to Texas, hanging out with hunters and making lots of $$ have captured a certain slice of the demographic, and I think Joe is probably at the mercy of the algorithmic winds at this point, in terms of his appeal. Hence, he circles around the alt-right rabbit hole, although he hasn't taken a full plunge yet. The target demographic - young, white, single, disaffected males with disposable income - is the goldilocks zone for advertisers. He has also smoked way too much weed, and has fried his synapses. That said, I think he's pretty likable, and not necessarily disingenuous - just a bit dim. There is no chance that Spotify will axe him (and nor should they), but I think he'll need to consider his content more carefully now he's made it into the big leagues. Spotify have sanitized his back-catalogue in order to remove episodes with racial slurs etc. - obviously a business decision based on the current climate. Because Spotify are also now a legacy media company, and are swimming in the same pond as MSNBC, Fox and CNN. So the notion that Joe Rogan - who is their exclusive bitch - can retain complete autonomy over his content is sort of risible. He has struck the deal with the devil, and now has to live with the consequences.
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